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Have you ever felt like a nobody in the world? To be in the world but not of the world is surely a frustrating reality in the normative workplace environment. But in the Catholic Education world? I never thought it would be such lonely, difficult work to teach, preach, and witness an orthodox Catholic message as a theology teacher in the typical American Catholic High School. Where to begin? The dark stuff.
The problems begin as always in the home. When we went to the other children’s birthday parties and I chatted with the other parents, I noticed in the Catholic elementary schools my own children attended it seemed like more than half were living with the complexity of divorce. I have read that Catholics on the whole have statistical rates for most societal vices on par with non-Catholics. We aren’t leading (morally speaking) even though we have plenty of Catholic “leaders” in our communities and nation.
I also find the divorce phenomena in my high school classrooms, and try to share my own damage assessment from growing up in a divorced home and not being raised a Christian even though I was baptized as a child. The problem is for the kids today, like for me back then, you don’t realize how the divorce thing is harming you on the inside and affecting all kinds of relationships- starting with God the Father and working down to preparing for your own Marital Vocation. “Everyone’s Fine” is the theme for the “Love, American Style” post sexual revolution. Awareness that everyone isn’t just fine is the first step- and for many of the sons and daughters of divorce that awareness doesn’t come until much adulthood has already passed and cycles of dysfunctional relationships continue on until one finally is awakened. The fact is that parents who have divorced have a vested interest in perpetuating the false myth that “the kids are alright.” Few people like to admit fault and fewer still will entertain thoughts that they have harmed their own children.
I would list Divorce as the first cause of the diminished faith of the Catholic school students I have encountered in my decade and a half of teaching experience. The causes of Divorce of course go back to the unorthodox treatment of Catholic teachings on matters to do with sexuality. The litany of anti-Catholic influences and abuses is legion- pornography exposure from early ages, masturbation addictions, premarital sex, same-sex exploration and experimentation, ‘my body my choice’ hardened feminism. These are the diseases that plague marriages from before they even begin. If you add other spiritual sicknesses like general hedonistic life philosophies “Seize the Day!” “If it feels good, do it!”, along with consumerism/materialism, sports and entertainment obsessions and so forth, you really have to wonder how anyone is supposed to live as a typical American and find their way Home to Rome!
If Catholic schools were factories, the end product would be lukewarm Catholics. The Catholic school is already disadvantaged by all of the home and cultural realities that are doing the primary shaping of the young American Catholic mind and spirit. I still believe we could do a heck of a lot more to raise the odds that more of these young Catholics/Christians/Other would find the shortcut to the Way of Christ if only we had our act together as Catholic Education Centers. I could recount many nightmarish stories of how most of the Catholic school educators and administrators I have encountered have been men and women of little or no faith in Christ and Church. Even in the religion departments it is common to encounter ex-nuns who feel the Church is in sin because they can’t be priests, homosexual men who are more interested in defending the lifestyle than in teaching the straight Catholic faith, and a range of those who are in dissent on some or another important Catholic doctrine.
If there are problems of personnel inside the Religion departments, the other disciplines are almost completely immersed in doing exactly what they would be doing in a public school. I have often wondered what small percentage of Catholic high school teachers actually like the Catholic Church. It is obvious that in hiring these folks, the biggest unspoken question is not “Are you enthusiastic about your Catholic faith?” but “Can you tolerate pretending to be on board with the Catholic stuff you will encounter from time to time here?” For the most part, average Catholic school teachers are solid as dispensers of information and want to bond with their students, but there is no real faith present in their hearts, and certainly not in the worldview presented in their classrooms.
Faithless teachers would not be so rampant if those charged with responsibility for the school’s Catholic mission were sincerely focused on a “Faith First” approach and philosophy. I have been at schools where I have spoken directly to administrators about this and to my face I was told that \”only one-third of the parents of Catholic school kids are there for the religious education, another one-third are there for sports, and the other one-third for the safety and academics.\” So, the piecemeal system of making a show of the faith for P.R. purposes becomes the smart strategy for keeping things appearing Catholic-enough for the one-third of parents primarily interested in the faith dimension, but for the two-thirds who are not, there is a wink-wink given that the real show is the academic and sports achievements.
And, now after a brief flurry of pressure coming from the Bishops for re-establishing a “Catholic Identity” in our Catholic schools, the primary focus around the country is on getting technology into the classrooms at breakneck speed. There is even a strange development whereupon in Communist China, the buzz is that Catholic schools are the best schools in America, and for the children of the elite who do not do well on their placement tests, they are coming to American Catholic schools so they can go to American universities and bypass the more difficult to get into Chinese universities. The Chinese students come here never hearing the name Jesus Christ before. This could be an excellent opportunity for evangelization, but evangelizing was never spoken of as part of any serious plan. Just drop them into religion classes with everyone else, and they end up being exposed to a very lukewarm variety of Catholicity- makes them probably wonder what the big fuss is back home, the faith doesn’t seem to alter the lifestyle of typical American Catholic students.
I have tried to make noise about all that I have written above. I’ve sent my letters to Superintendents and invited Bishops to dinner, but all I have received has been either polite thanks, or direct negative consequences. But here are my recommendations anyway:
1. Catholic identity is #1- hire right. Seek and find enthusiastic wanna-be orthodox Catholics to fill in the ranks of at least 90% of the faculty and staff positions. Help the teachers out by getting serious about locating textbooks that include positive Catholic worldview even in non-religion subject areas. As it stands now, the textbooks outside of religion classes are the same one would see in public schools, with all the problems of the culture seeping in.
2. Praise and worship should be given primary place in school activities. The mainstream music that is played throughout Catholic school sporting events, dances, gym classes etc. is the same junk that is being played everywhere, songs full of obscenity, sexual immorality, violence and despair. Why can’t Catholic schools be bastions for Christian music promotion? One only has to attend a sporting event, a dance or a school play to assess the strength of an actual Catholic influence and identity.
3. Catholic schools should be centers for Eucharistic Adoration. They could offer Theology of the Body classes, Pro-life activism, Catholic Relief Services, Fair Trade marketing, nurturing future community and political leaders with our full Catholic social doctrine and sexual ethics. Wow!
4. I have seen that the male-female interactions of the current generation are just not very healthy. One of the sad results of the Sexual Revolution is the pressure on young girls to get involved in sexual relationships, and even regard themselves as sex objects to match the mainstream culture. With divorce comes along a lot of girls who are going without a daily dose of a father’s affectionate love. They turn to the boys who often are addicted to pornography and don’t comprehend chastity. To combat this we need return to more traditional schools of all-boys and all-girls, or at least have classes separated into boy and girl classrooms with teachers best suited as role-models teaching one gender or the other.
© 2013. Francis. All Rights Reserved.
124 thoughts on “Confessions of a Wanna-Be Orthodox Catholic High School Teacher”
Francis, where are you teaching, and how can I sign my kids up?
Thanks for this. I went to a pretty good Catholic all girls school growing up (my choice) and the same issues were definitely there as well. I loved my time there, but there is always room for improvement. I was a great minority, being enthusiastic about my faith, in a school of 800 other young women.
Phil- the book is more about the positive fruits of Christianity and as an Orthodox Christian he isn’t trying to make a defense of the Catholic Church
Ok, like I say I will read & get it off amazon very soon. It will be an interesting comparison to Hitchens and DS Murdock, both whose scholarship I have come to admire.
For Phil et al here is a book recommendation I thoroughly enjoyed- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atheist_Delusions
From David Bentley Hart- http://yalepress.yale.edu/book.asp?isbn=9780300111903
Thank you, I will read as I am a voracious reader but I am not an atheist who denies god, rather a pantheist who who sees and unites with source in all.
Mary ann- I tend to agree that Catholic elementary schools do a better job than high schools at cultivating the faith- but as you alluded- once the more controversial aspects of the faith emerge there is a lot of dissent among the faculty- too often including in the religion department. Also- I have a heck of a time trying to lobby at the elementary school level to try and get Catholic literature into the library and classes- there has been zero interest in even trying to bring in specifically Catholic literature- I’ve found websites like catholicfiction with some young adult fiction but in the schools all they could find were some old lives of the Saints type books. So the problem of Catholic schools ignoring the Catholic worldview as applies to disciplines other than religion class starts early and stays throughout the school experience. The other problem I’ve noted at the elementary level is the lack of desire to separate the genders for sports or anything else- no interest in having separate classrooms even for girls and boys- and I’m not sure how widespread it is- but the whole 6th grade inclusion in the middle school phenomena is not one I like- there is a big developmental difference between 6th and 8th graders- and the exposure to the corruption in language and romantic coupling has been a real hardship for my child. We all know our culture is off the charts inappropriate with profanity, and relations between the sexes- so why not push back with some commonsensical distinctions that are possible in private Catholic schools? Again- it seems that the leaders in CAtholic schools are trying to be like charter schools focused on P.R. more than getting back to the Gospel- maybe Pope Francis will start a trend back to more earnest effort on the part of the Bishops who seem to hire superintendants who are more worldly and numbers driven than the Faith First that actually works over the long term. But Catholic schools have somehow been put on the corporate path and like the modern day corporation the focus is always on the next quarter’s earnings- very short term thinking- and principals know they need to keep the numbers up or they are gone straight away- not much room for someone who is trying to shore up a really strong Catholic identity which risks losing some students in the short run.
Great article! First I want to thank you for being so committed and passionate about transmitting the faith to high school students in your corner of the world. It’s amazing that often converts to the Catholic faith are much more enthusiastic and uninhibited in living out their beliefs.
We have three children who have all gone through Catholic elementary and (almost all through)co-ed Catholic high school, with the oldest two moving on to New York’s public university system. Our experience with Catholic teachers is mixed. I think on the elementary level the faith is more emphatically taught because those are the formative years for receiving the sacraments. Unfortunately, when the students need the most guidance in navigating a secular world (high school years) the passion in teaching seems to dwindle. At least on Long Island, many Catholic high schools are run more like businesses; competing to attract the best athletes and brightest academic students, to maintain national notoriety. Tuition is high and parental expectations are often more concerned with the high school grooming their children for future college scholarships rather than forming them into adults with a strong moral compass. Because of many of the points you brought up in your article, most parents are satisfied when the school system doesn’t push too hard on controversial moral topics.
We have discovered that it takes a tremendous amount of parental example and engaging our kids in conversation to make sure they were being correctly spiritually formed! We couldn’t just take for granted they were getting all the facts in theology class. It’s sad but true that most teachers don’t want to rock the boat, and worry more about being politically correct and encouraging tolerance, even in a Catholic HS environment. Kudos to you for being brave enough to actually teach your students the faith beyond the minimum requirement!
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The priority of praise and worship speaks strongly to me. Almost every prayer that I say each day was first taught to me at school. Almost every liturgical service I can remember (and there are many) was a part of my school activities.
Christianity is not just a philosophy, it is the revealed Truth.
By the way I totally endorse the step taken by the Bishop in Santa Rosa- I have thrown out the idea of having all Catholic Theology teachers in the Dioceses sign a special Oath of Fidelity to at least put every theology teacher on the spot of his or her conscience- to be honest that teaching dissent knowingly is in violation of their job expectation. It would be a great step forward in bringing unity to those who just want to see Catholic schools teach the straight-up Catholic catechetical deal. It is what it is, and I love it so I know I’m doing what I’m supposed to be doing.
Thanks Jeff for the assist on that- I was hoping to find if my experiences are as common as I suspected.
For st. D. You mentioned you disagreed with my point about marriages sometimes “work” and sometimes don’t. I wasn’t agreeing with the point I made I was listed it as a common attitude that negatively affects the institution of marriage- I believe that true Marriage is an unbreakable Sacramental bond- naturally separations may become necessary in cases of abuse and so forth- but I believe the Catholic teachings on the indissolvibility of Marriage
Actually, I thought you did, I just wanted to make sure that point was made. Of course, we can control ourselves but not our mate. We can be a good example, and do anything we can to keep our spouse but sometimes they leave sometimes they abuse etc. But again, that is the reason to train our children well about finding a mate. Also, the only relationship that will bring us true happiness is that with God. I think our ancestors understood that much better than we today and that is a major reason why vocations to the priesthood were so much greater back then.
A study by Lawton & Bures (2001) in the Journal for the Scientific Study of Religion indicated that one of the sequelae of parental divorce is indeed “religious disaffiliation” — particularly among Catholics and conservative Protestants.
The sample was drawn from the 1987 National Survey of Families and Households (compiled by the University of Wisconsin, Madison) and it includes a sizable sub-sample of 3,461 Catholics and 3,782 conservative Protestants.
Their analysis found that for Catholics, parental divorce more than doubles the likelihood of abandoning faith altogether. An even stronger effect was found for conservative Protestants.
Jeff,
I did take your comment seriously and researched the study you referred to. Truth be known I read the abstract. I would concur that divorce is one of the factors that contribute to the separation. disaffiliation or change of faith. However, the premise of the post written by the author was that divorce was a main or prime factor to disaffiliation.
In 2010-12, two researchers from St Joseph University and the other from Villanova’s Center for the Study of Church Management conducted an anecdotal study at the request of the bishop of Trenton, NJ. He asked them to study why people were leaving the RC Church. The results were similar to my stated reasons much earlier in this blog. They discovered 7 reasons..divorce did not make the list, but I am sure it is a factor.
http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2012/03/30/7-reasons-catholics-leave-church-in-trenton-1-is-sex-abuse-crisis/
Some quick points- since you know I am busy teaching all day! My divorce hypothesis has been germinating for some time based upon my awareness of the power of the domestic church- the role of home life and parents in the instruction on morals and faith life for the young. As an adult convert I was taken aback by the many lukewarm and/or cafeteria cradle Catholics I encountered. One school says that the fault is Catholic doctrine- it is old and wrongheaded- out of touch with modern realities. OK- but my own attraction to Catholicism was that I came to see the Church as the Church Christ founded and guaranteed a protective function at the doctrinal level to prevent serious errors on matters of faith and morals to seep into believer’s hearts and minds. So, for me doctrine wasn’t the problem- giving proper witness of the Catholic doctrines was the problem. I noticed that many of the Catholic school kids had a divorced home situation- like I grew up with- and I know firsthand how those undercurrents can really deeply influence many things about a person as they move from youth to adulthood- those studies are commonplace- I simply extrapolated these obvious findings along with my own direct experience and indirect student observations and put together a hypothesis that unorthodoxy and lukewarmness in our Catholic youth can be encouraged by children being affected by their divorced parent home life situations.
If what we do as Catholic educators is really ‘clean up’ work or secondary helps for parents on the moral and faith fronts- then it is no wonder that we are being stymied by the lack of enthusiastic orthodox CAtholic faith witness at the home level. My beef is with my profession- that we could be doing so very much more to provide additional helps for the youth to become invigorated as faith-filled CAtholics despite not having that foundation at home. I know that I did transcend the lack of faith that my parents witnessed at home. I wish that the Catholic schools were staffed by enthusiastic Catholic role-models who were Faith first focused and doing all the smart things like bringing in Catholic worldview textbooks, music, culture to the school- backing up what is supposed to be happening in the theology classrooms. Alas this isn’t happening largely. I do put first responsibility on the bishops shoulders- if the bishop says “boo!” things happen- people fear for their jobs- but the bishops aren’t seeking or allowing the reports of orthodox teachers like myself to come into their decision making – they seem to be trusting the degrees of the superintendents instead of going down the ranks to the foot soldiers. The buck has to stop with the bishop- he is the ceo- he has the clout in the diocesan schools- I have been trying to get through but the school culture is thick with dissent and self-deception about the underlying spiritual problems.
Hi Francis,
I really appreciate your article. I am coming at all of this from a different perspective than yours. I was raised in a very Catholic home where my father was sure we knew the faith and my mother was sure we said the rosary. I know that that is a huge blessing and that my parents have a great reward waiting for them in heaven. As it is now, they have 9 children who still practice the faith, which is nearly unheard of among families raised in the 60’s through 80’s. Among the nine siblings, I am the only one who is divorced, so I am experiencing a divorce history that comes from the opposite side of yours. I do see the effect that divorce has had on my children’s faith. Four of my children are currently either hostile to the faith or severely apathetic. I have to say, though, that while they obviously have found friends who reflect their attitudes, most of these friends are not from divorced families. This is especially true for my daughter who is a senior at a Catholic high school. Her friends’ parents are married, yet they have no more use for the faith than she does. That makes me think that there is more to it than just divorce.
My belief is that contraception also has had a tremendously bad effect on the life of faith in Catholic homes. What percent of parents who enroll their children in Catholic high schools use birth control? What percent of Catholic high school teachers use birth control? How many teachers in those schools lived or are living with their boyfriend or girlfriend? How can we expect these people, who are objectively in grave sin, to be able to teach the faith to our children? I am not judging these people, I am only observing that we can’t play games with sexual morality and think we can somehow raise children who aren’t fair game for the culture that has so influenced the parents and teachers. And it is one heck of a sick culture. Any thoughts on the effect that birth control has on the parents, educators and therefor the students of Catholic schools?
(The quote featured above your article makes me so sad because I wonder the same thing, yet I can see how being in a state of sin through the use of bc would make one less fond of the Church!)
I have worked as a faculty member at a Catholic high school for several years, and find this article to be spot on; I have also served as a music director at a Catholic parish for eight years.
My own observation is that the current Catholic high school is only different from a public high school in that one is allowed to mention the name of God without fear of the ACLU; beyond that there is – sadly – little that is ‘Catholic’ anymore in most ‘Catholic high schools. I can say the same for most ‘Catholic’ universities as well.
Anybody that has read St. Thomas Aquinas, G.K. Chesterton, St. Augustine and other Catholic writers should realize that Catholicism is not a religion which only sustains itself on the ‘uneducated.’
In regard to Catholic teaching on sexuality – if one truly studies it – one finds a beautiful call to total self-giving, true love, and an obedience to the innate law of our own biology; we have forgotten natural law so that entire concept seems foreign to modern society.
My prayers for Francis and all those who continue to work in the field of Catholic education as orthodox Catholics.
What is really sad, is that Phil Dzialo proves Francis’ point perfectly. Why is a man who obviously doesn’t or didn’t have a solid footing in his faith in God, doing as a ‘VP in a Catholic High School…1974-1979 in MA’.
What do we think that the effect on his students were? Very very scary.
Dear Saint Donatus
I love the way you judge with no facts. 33 years I was as orthodox and believing and conforming as a cradle RC can be…never deviated from the party line and held everyone to it. 30 years later I am thankfully not the same person as I saw my error many years later. You did not know me 33+ years ago…
BTW, I really am offput by people who hide behind a pseudonym or an anonymous identity. Something about hiding your light under a bushel basket bothers me….
So phil you are 63 with a 27 year old son who you’ve been taking crae of 24/7 for 15 years. That leaves you 36 years of life into which you crammed 30 years as a principle!! You started at 6 years of age!! WOW
Let me ask a question if I may. Were your parents divorced?
No my parents were NEVER divorced, neither was I…again I’d be happy to give you a breakdown of my life and send you the book my wife wrote…email me at [email protected]
Perhaps I could also assist you with your math
Well Phil, I don’t think taking care of a loved one is an excuse for abusing God and his organization on Earth. I too have spent the lasts 25 years caring for sick and disabled relatives. But I don’t wear it as a badge or use it as an excuse. In fact, most of my friends and co-workers don’t even know about these trials. I have found that the best thing to do is offer these trials up to God as an sacrifice, as penance, as a display of my love for him.
Thus far I have been caring for my wife’s 92 year old father which involves 200 mile weekly trips to the hospital, we took care of her mother until she died of cancer, we took care of her ‘mentally disabled’ niece, and I have a severely ‘mentally disabled’ sister. We also helped care for my own mother and father. We haven’t had a break in 20 years. On top of this, I work full time and my wife works part time (so she can care for her father every couple of hours.)
Otherwise, I understand the pain and hardship of caring for loved ones, changing their diapers, cleaning their beds, trying to give them baths, feeding them and many more challenges. But part of that time I went without God and became resentful of these obligations. Once I came back to the Catholic Church, I started understanding that these things could be both a blessing and a lesson. I have learned that by staying busy all the time, there is no time to fulfill selfish desires. No recreation, no shopping, no vacations, no getting rich, but there is always enough time to pray to God and ask for his help.
I will pray that you find your way back to Gods church and that you find relief in his Grace.
Please DO NOT pray for me…my reference to my care for my son was not to brag but to assert that I do not need a god or a religion to do good. Praying for me is akin to Mormons who create lists of dead people and baptize them. I would totally resent someone praying for me to a person whom I do not believe in…thanks for the offer, anyway!
Parents are the primary educators of children. This is not just a prescriptive for parents to follow, it is also a fact of life. Regardless of a parent’s belief that they are primary educators, they are still primary; in general, they influence children and teach them even if they intend to not teach them anything for that is still teaching something. There is plenty of studies that deal with the problem of divorce’s effects on children and regarding their education in particular (if you want evidence, look it up, I simply typed into google and found scholarly peer reviewed journals, there are plenty to choose from). If the Catholic faith is primarily passed on via the family because they are primary, then I would suspect that the family’s breakdown will impact keeping the faith negatively.
The priestly scandal, horrible no doubt, really shouldn’t shake a person’s Faith because our Faith teaches to place our trust in Jesus Christ and that as humans we are fallen and so have a tendency to sin. I would suspect that if a person’s faith was shaken by the scandals, it is because they placed their trust too much in a sinful person rather than in Christ. Whether or not those shaken in their faith understand this teaching regarding concupiscence is another question. If a person thinks that all priests must be perfect and those priests show signs of sin, my faith would be shaken too. The problem is that is not the teaching of the Church.
Amen. Well-said.
JQ said: “The priestly scandal, horrible no doubt, really shouldn’t shake a person’s Faith because our Faith teaches to place our trust in Jesus Christ and that as humans we are fallen and so have a tendency to sin. I would suspect that if a person’s faith was shaken by the scandals, it is because they placed their trust too much in a sinful person rather than in Christ.”
Amen! I say to you, Amen! I am so pleased to hear someone articulate this point so well. Thank you.
Agreed.
It is time for bishops to clean house and restore Catholicism to church sponsored entities like education and charities. These are arms of the mission of the Church and hence ought to be staffed by people who believe AND practice the Catholic faith. We need to restore Catholic identity – meaning we are that which is contained in the catechism of the Catholic Church. What and who deviates from it do NOT represent the Catholic faith and need to be expunged.
When the bishops begin once again to see their role as defenders of the faith and what is truth in terms of the teachings of Jesus Christ and His Church, things will begin to improve. And we won’t need to be concerned about numbers since people will ALWAYS be attracted to the truth where it is unequivocably proclaimed.
If you want an example of a bishop who clearly understands his ministry, check into Bishop Robert Vasa of Santa Rosa CA. You’ll see an example of what I am referring to.
Francis,
If the data on divorce and the decline of faith-participation is evident and accepted, please provide the data. I presented a recent meta study to the contrary.
I have 30 years of experience as a principal in a 7-12 school and I do not see the evidence of anecdotes you claim. You can not makes claims about what affects the faith of young based on anecdotes…if there is data please present it. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof.
You have experience as a principal in a Catholic school?
Only 2 years and 3 years as a VP in a Catholic High School…1974-1979 in MA
Phil,
1. Taking care of your son does NOT make you a good person. You could be just as big a jerk as anyone else and you are just as big of a sinner as anyone else. The Bible tells us that there is no one who is good but God (Jesus)
2. How do you have 30 years experience as a principle if your son is 27 and you’ve been caring for him 24/7 for the last 15 years? Seems that you’d have to have had him when you were quite aged already. Assuming you were a principle for the twelve years you weren’t caring for him (as a disabled person that is) then you would have had to have been a principle for 18 years prior to his birth. I have never heard of someone coming straight out of school into a principleship, or being a principle without at least a bachelors degree.
So. 22 years old out of college. roughly 15 years as a teacher or other school admin staff until principle. That makes you 37 at the barest minimum. 18 years as principle before your son was born. makes you 55 at the time of his birth. Kind of old to be a daddy.
3. With the exception of the homosexual priest issue, all the concerns you raised are evidences that someone has already left the church rather than reasons for them to leave.
For example. The church teaches sexual purity. If someone disagrees with that they have already disagreed with the church demonstrating diminished faith.
It’s important to not confuse the symptoms of the problem with the cause of the problem.
Thank you for your kind words….give me an e-mail and I’ll chronologically give you my life story: [email protected] and send you a copy of a book my wife wrote about our lives.
thanks for all the commentary- I think the data on the divorce effect for kids is pretty much established- I am only extrapolating that the negatives go deeper into regions of the spirit where it is difficult to find empirical data- but having more than a decade in classrooms with teens gives me something more than casual anecdotal evidence. The fact that I have my own background with being raised in a divorce situation also helps me to have confidence in some of the conclusions I draw above.
Divorce is an unnatural state of affairs- it divides parents and oftentimes siblings. It puts parents into good guy v. bad guy encampments with loads of hidden baggage. It also seems to encourage parents to be more lenient, indulgent of their kids when clear lines and lessons should be the order of the day. At least one of the parents typically feels the need to justify their dubious choices- and this leads to a latent teaching of “tolerance” of any choice we feel inclined to make to create more personal “happiness”. As teenagers this lesson in “tolerance” is a recipe for all sorts of moral confusion- both personal and doctrinal. I see this show up when I ask my teen students the question: “If there was one issue that would see yourself standing up and doing something about to help make the world better- what would it be?” The answers range- but interestingly there is a small percentage that say “marriage and family issues” and in that small percentage among my current classes all of those students are standing for same sex marriage not traditional marriage as the way to ‘save the world’. I think it is obvious that a lot of teens carry a very subjective meaning to sexuality and marriage- where does this come from? I would suggest that the culture can only do so much to shift reality- the home environment is the front line of reality check. When there is a divorce there is a sense that romantice love is the be it and have all of marriage- and when that romantic love wavers then all bets are off for the “marriage”. The fact that annulments are seemingly easy to obtain given the state of immaturity for most Americans getting “married” only leads many Catholics to question how the Catholic comprehension of Marriage is different from everyone elses.
The bottom-line is that there seems to be an unconscious casualness in many cradle Catholics when it comes to the Faith. It is something they can slip in and slip out of when the mood fits. Faith is personal, sexual ethics is subjective, marriage sometimes “works” and sometimes doesn’t work out. Doctrinal orthodoxy is one of the first casualties of this popular attitude/mindset.
Francis,
I really enjoyed your article. So very true. I have a hard time understanding why the Catholic School system doesn’t do more to address its own shortcomings with so many educators not believing Church teaching. I know the Church tries to be loving to these teachers, but please, not at the expense of our children’s everlasting life. They must learn the truth and be helped to believe it. They will get all the anti-God propaganda in the world without our Catholic school contributing.
I would have to disagree on one point you made, you said ‘marriage sometimes “works” and sometimes doesn’t work out’. Marriages don’t ‘not work out’, they are contaminated by selfishness, sometimes by one spouse, sometimes by both.
Sad to say, I am divorced and selfishness got me into the marriage, and it got me out of the marriage. Now I have a daughter that has a real problem dealing with relationships, God, and life. I think I am a good person, I thought I was a good person then. Our society has taken GOOD to a whole new low. Sad to say, our society doesn’t even want to acknowledge the damage we are doing to our children.
My God, I wasn’t only not good, I was bad, a student of Satan. Yes, young people ‘fall in love’ and don’t listen to reason. (And when a product of a broken home as I was, become codependent.) But if they don’t have high standards to start out with, how can they make good judgements about a spouse. We Catholics have taken the idea of loving and not judging beyond what Jesus meant. We don’t need to teach our children to have evil people as close friends and not to judge when someones actions are against God. They need standards to go by when finding a spouse.
We can’t end divorce for Catholics until we start teaching our kids to have standards, to understand that marriage is forever so pick wisely. It can be a life sentence or a life of happiness, it is their decision. There is NO ‘Get out of Marriage’ free card in a Catholic life.
The problem with blanket statements is that “sometimes” they aren’t accurate. Statistically divorce is detrimental to children and relationships. Incidentally, that is not always the case. In my case, my children are MORE Catholic because I divorced their non-Catholic, non-practicing christian father and married a man who supports my beliefs and education of my children.
That being said, I do agree that despite the fact that there are many non-Catholic children in Catholic schools, the quality of catechism is sorely lacking. And the mistakes that many Catholics themselves make about the Church’s “position” on hot button issues is directly a result of inadequate catechism.
How can you support something if you don’t really understand it? But the truth is, catechism starts in the domestic church. If parents don’t support the teachings, its hard to get kids to do the same no matter how you try.
I understand your loneliness in the world because of your faith. It is very hard being in the minority because of your faith. Good luck.
Hmmm … I teach in a public high school. Exact same things Francis has observed are 100 fold found in the public schools. Not rocket science, Phil. Sometimes common sense sees the Truth without the help of “data”. Don’t let the worship of “facts” drive everything. Our “fact-based” society has devolved into a country of which I am none too fond –the sins we’ve put on the pedestal of Reason seem none too reasonable; hence, our navel gazing has descended to the genitalia. There are times I feel I have to shower the vomit from my person when the school day is over AND the District wants to train me in how to carry and use a gun. The degeneration has amazed me when I do a comparison/contrast from just even 20 years ago.
I wrote a book about this a couple of years ago.
https://gracesreceived.com/store/bridegroompress/books/designed-to-fail-catholic-education-in-america
While your solution is interesting, it won’t work.
As I point out in the book, there is no Catholic University that trains teachers to be Catholic. Even if the principals wanted them (and they don’t), the teachers cannot be located in sufficient quantity to staff the schools that exist.
As I point out in the book, the solutions will require bishops to change their relationships with, and their understanding of, Catholic education.
The whole point will be moot within our lifetime. Schools, whether private or public, are designed to be warehouses to hold children while the parents work. For a variety of reasons, that whole model cannot continue. Now it’s just a question of how long it takes the bishops to realize this.
Having taught in several Catholic school settings (6-12th grades) I can relate completely with Francis’ message. I have experienced the frustration of being Catholic in a nominal Catholic school setting. My last job criticized me for being “too Catholic” even though I had described myself as a Catholic strongly influenced by JohnPaul II. I even told them not to hire me of they were not looking for a solid Catholic. As to Phil’s comments, I am reminded of a quote fom the Song of Bernadette “to those who believe, no explanation is necessary, to those who do not, no explanation is possible.” He is not well informed but rather disgruntled. He is obviously not willing to listen to sound reason so no attempt is needed. His comment on the LCRW clearly shows that he has not read the document produced by the Church nor tried to understand the issue.
Thanks or your post Francis
“Divorce” as the first cause of diminished faith in Catholic students? You have to be kidding…what empirical data do you have to support this assertion. Here are the major reasons for diminished faith, supported by the fact that of all self-identified Catholics in the US only 20-24% attend mass.
(1) The poor, criminal handling of the clergy sex abuse crises. Criminals like Bernie Law and Roger Mahoney, who covered up abuse and transferred pedophiles around we rewarded and not defrocked. Bishops like Dupree who molested kids were sent on retreat. Few priests were defrocked and no bishop or cardinal was defrocked. The handling of the abuse turned many away.
(2) The RC Church’s obsession with sex. No psychologist or psychiatrist would agree that masturbation is unnatural. All primates masturbate and no one is hurt. The vast majority ofCatholic women disavow the position on contraception. And 63% of self-identified catholics in the US disagree with the church’s position on gay marriage.
(3) The church’s position on women, i.e. the LCRW (picking on poor nuns who are on the firing line), misogyny (women cannot be priests, even though the first pope (ST Peter) was a married man, and the outright lie that a male priesthood cannot be changed.
(4)An educated public: they are aware that since about 1000 BCE there were at least 30 born of virgins, dying on a cross/tree and rising gods. The RC Church thrived on poor, uneducated people who had no tools to question those statements about life which were said to be infallible. You notice growth of Christianity is among the poor and the illiterate.
The loss of faith is the result of a church not in the trenches, one that has lost it sense of mission and out of touch with society and the common man.
I believe this loss of faith and credibility of the RC Church is the work of the Holy Spirit…deconstructing the church so that it can begin again and be what it should be. Amen!
The “obsession with sex” is clearly yours, Phil Dzialo. And it has led you astray.
I agree with Francis that the widespread acceptance of divorce has led to widespread social pathologies, especially pathologies that damage children. The empirical data for this is everywhere. And the scandal of America’s divorce culture has been around a lot longer than the one you tried to obscure the plain facts of experience with, Phil Dzialo. People who have chosen to leave the Church are often cowardly, they typically grab onto any excuse that doesn’t require them to examine their own conscience rather than be honest why they got lazy about their own personal sinfulness.
Micha, Thank you for your very judgmental, condemnatory response wrapped in an absence of data and logic. I have taken care of a 27 year old son who is non-mobile, non-verbal, non everything for 24/7 for the past 15 years…that makes me a good person. I do not judge people; but I make judgments about data driven facts.
But, really, it’s nice to know that there are people out there who cast judgments about people “being obsessed with sex” when you know nothing of their lives. I judge institutions and ideas, not people. Apology, please….Oh, you didn’t address any of my issues…
Most youth don’t leave because of Phil’s reasons. The scandals only affect most them through the media’s use of them to tar the entire Church. To say that it is the Church that is obsessed with sex is simply insane. Watch TV for a few days, listen to the music, watch a few movies…our culture is obsessed with perversity. Certainly many disagree with Catholic teachings, but look at the results. Women are treated as objects to be used, millions of children killed before they are born, and yes a divorce rate through the roof. If you don’t think divorce hurts than you are also nuts. Look at the children. Likewise most know as little as Phil does about why it is impossible for women to be ordained. The whole concept he illustrates is that gender means nothing, a fallacy of our sick culture. Men and women are not the same. 25% of our population is functionally illiterate. Most others have only a shallow education. Phil is among them as he seems to have no idea that the Church has a response to his claims. In fact the Church founded the university system and preserved culture in the monasteries. I would say that Phil does certainly wish to “deconstruct” the Church, much in the manner that Lucifer would prefer. No apologies necessary Phil, I would prefer you to do some profound rethinking of the propaganda points you have offered us.
Fr. J
I assume you are a priest…Best listen to the words of Benedict 16, emeritus because he spoke the truth:
“Today we see in a truly terrifying way that the greatest persecution of the Church does not come from enemies on the outside, but is born of the sin within the Church” May 11, 2010
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/pope-benedict-fears-catholic-church-worst-enemy-sin-article-1.183697
BTW, I have difficulty with bloggers who use pseudonyms or hide behind the cloak of anonymity. Care to share you identity…
““Divorce” as the first cause of diminished faith in Catholic students? You have to be kidding…what empirical data do you have to support this assertion.”
Ye olde ‘it must be empirically proven or it’s out-of-bounds” demand. I thought the explanation for the divorce connection was an excellent one (you did not refute it, either, but just dismissed the section based on the headline). I see this with my students. It works this way…parents are role models of the faith (and everything else) and images of God, especially the father (see the work of psychologist Paul Vitz on this). When the parents not only do not practice the faith but alienate themselves because they mistakenly believe they cannot receive sacraments if they are divorced, they stop attending mass and so the kids don’t attend mass. Attending mass also reminds parents of the nature of self-sacrificial love and may even make them feel guilty for having not remained faithful to the vows they made on their wedding day. Most children of divorced parents are shuffled back and forth on weekends or alternating weekends or whatever and so who has time for mass? That’s how it works…
“Here are the major reasons for diminished faith, supported by the fact that of all self-identified Catholics in the US only 20-24% attend mass. (1) The poor, criminal handling of the clergy sex abuse crises. Criminals like Bernie Law and Roger Mahoney, who covered up abuse and transferred pedophiles around we rewarded and not defrocked. Bishops like Dupree who molested kids were sent on retreat. Few priests were defrocked and no bishop or cardinal was defrocked. The handling of the abuse turned many away.”
Perhaps, but most likely those who left were looking for an excuse or a scapegoat anyway. Why would a few Judases negate Jesus? Does the fact that a small percentage of the Church’s priests acted in gravely sinful ways mean that Jesus is not truly risen from the dead or that the Church is not His Bride? Of course not. It does not logically follow. Non-sequitor.
“(2) The RC Church’s obsession with sex. No psychologist or psychiatrist would agree that masturbation is unnatural. All primates masturbate and no one is hurt. The vast majority ofCatholic women disavow the position on contraception. And 63% of self-identified catholics in the US disagree with the church’s position on gay marriage.”
It seems to me that it’s the culture that’s obsessed with sex. The reason we hear more about sexual morality from the Church today is because it’s the area of conflict with the culture. No one really takes issue with the Church’s social teaching on the poor or on forgiveness. But on sex and family are the places the culture needs the most conversion, so naturally we hear more about this. ‘I did not come for the well but for the sick…’ Your use of the term ‘natural’ regarding masturbation shows a lack of understanding which is most likely why you hate the Church. When the Church uses the term “unnatural’ with regard to masturbation it means ‘not in accord with the nature of” the sexual faculty. Clearly our sexual faculty is for sexual intercourse and sex is for procreation. No one can honestly deny this. Even the couple who uses contraception knows sex is for procreation…that’s why they use contraception. Your statistics about the number of people who struggle to understand Catholic teaching is irrelevant. Truth is not determined by counting noses. If the Church simply went along with whatever people “wanted”, She would be useless and certainly not a “city set on a hill”.
“(3) The church’s position on women, i.e. the LCRW (picking on poor nuns who are on the firing line), misogyny (women cannot be priests, even though the first pope (ST Peter) was a married man, and the outright lie that a male priesthood cannot be changed.”
The Church did not “pick on” the LCWR. Did you even read the visitation report? It affirmed the good work the vast majority of women religious do every day. The LCWR is a small group (relatively speaking) of women religious who have willfully and in their own words stepped outside the bounds of the Church and the Catholic faith. The document simply acknowledged that and observed it as a problem. It is not “misogyny” to believe that woman cannot be priests anymore than it is misanthropy to say that men cannot be mothers. What does the fact that Peter was married (maybe not when he was a disciple though) have to do with anything? The nature of the priesthood cannot change. Pope John Paul II spoke clearly about this in Ordinatio sacerdotalis. If you do not recognize his right and ability to speak authoritatively in this way means the Church is something radically different even from what She Herself professes to be!
“(4)An educated public: they are aware that since about 1000 BCE there were at least 30 born of virgins, dying on a cross/tree and rising gods.”
This is just historically silly. Even if it were true (which it is not), it would not follow that Jesus was not God in the flesh or that the Church is the one He founded on Peter. Logic! Sheesh…what do they teach in schools these days…
“The RC Church thrived on poor, uneducated people who had no tools to question those statements about life which were said to be infallible. You notice growth of Christianity is among the poor and the illiterate.”
The Church has always been at the forefront of the sciences and fostered the growth of culture and learning. It is a modern myth to say otherwise. Someone apparently thought Dan Brown was writing history books…?
“The loss of faith is the result of a church not in the trenches, one that has lost it sense of mission and out of touch with society and the common man.”
The loss of faith it the result of people who have stepped out of the trenches and been mowed down by the secular, relativistic, nihilistic, selfish, anti-human culture. The Church is “out of touch”, agreed…and thank God for it. Only if the light is not like the darkness, only if it is “out of touch” with turning off the lights can it be a beacon of truth and hope.
“I believe this loss of faith and credibility of the RC Church is the work of the Holy Spirit…deconstructing the church so that it can begin again and be what it should be. Amen!”
You have been handed an image of the Church that is not the true one…Brother, return to Christ with all your heart…He is waiting for you in the Eucharist. And remember, “Upon this rock I will build my Church and the gates of hell will not prevail against it.”
Ryan,
Respectfully, before allowing the assertion that divorce is the most significant factor in the decline of “faith” among the young, it is important to look at the research not personal anecdotes…data drives decisions.
http://www.abpnews.com/culture/social-issues/item/8280-study-questions-divorce%E2%80%99s-impact-on-faith#.UUpCFhzCaSo
I am willing to accept the reality that my reasoning for the decline of faith among the young is wrong if data, research and objective standards refute my reasoning. Personal anecdotes get us nowhere, nor does blaming society, media and culture. If we want to examine the failures of an institution, we must first look to the institution itself, then to forces outside the institution.
Unless I am wrong B16 spoke about the greatest enemies of the Church that lie within: “Today we see in a truly terrifying way that the greatest persecution of the Church does not come from enemies on the outside, but is born of the sin within the Church” B16
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/pope-benedict-fears-catholic-church-worst-enemy-sin-article-1.183697
BTW Phil, your love for your son is a profound witness. Thank you for your example of self-sacrificial love.
I do what I do because it is right….it is not self-sacrifice; it is the moral and ethical obligation of a father to a son…unconditional love. This is not heroic, it is simply the right thing to do.
Phil,
Having been stalked on the net I don’t care to share my identity. I notice that you did not respond to my responses to you. The persecutors of the Church are those who hold your opinions. You agree with them not with the Church. So who is really doing the persecuting? The Church offers you the truth that comes from God. You quote Pope Benedict and that is good. Why not read what he says about sexuality, women’s ordination, and the other issues you bring up. Do you agree with him?
Fr J
Sorry, I did not answer your question. I will try with utmost honesty. I too have been stalked on my blog for I post about disability issues. http://www.healingandempowerment.blogspot.com I do not stalk anyone and I am always upfront about who I am. A number of people don’t like that I speak the truth as I perceive it. But my integrity demands that I stand.
To attempt to answer your questions. I have no problems with people’s beliefs; I have many problems with institutional actions. As B16 stated, the most terrifying enemies of the church are within: a lack of transparency, power, wealth, pretense, abuse, misogyny. Here are specifics: I do not believe that the RC Church is a respository of THE truth, nor that the Bible is revealed by a deity. We all know no original manuscripts exist. We know that a fragment from John exist from about 100 CE and that the emperor Constantine in the 300’s CE ordered the first complete codex. The word has been revised, translated, mistranslated and the gnostic gospels left out. We know that the only external references to Jesus are a paragraph by Josephus and words by Pliny (both believed insertions). So what may have been inspired and revealed doesn’t exist and tradition had been changed and re-written hundreds of times.
I know that there have been 30 born of virgins, crucified on a cross or tree, and risen from the dead gods begining with Horus and Isis in the Egyptian mystery schools. The Bible story and the Christ story has been seen historically in many religious variants.
So, I do not believe in a personal deity, I do not believe in the infallibility of the Pope, I believe that the RC Church relegated women to an inferior role and establish a patriarchy in the era from 700-1300. Remember that the goddess Gaia was displaced by a male god. Even Pope Francis will say that women are excluded from the priesthood, but has used the words “at this time” and “presently.” Celibacy and the exclusion of women from the priesthood, I believe are, are matters of church practice and discipline and not dogma. We know that Peter, the first pope, was a married man…why would his successors be celibate?
I read much about the RC Church and an quite familiar with early fathers. Things are fluid, like Aquinas’ theory of ensoulment which everyone avoids discussing.
I am a panthiest and believe that god is all, a powerful energy of pure love and that our mission in life is to join with the source and to be good people. I believe the source is our guide and that we have spiritual guides that I have met with help. I believe that none of the prophets of many sacred texts wanted to create institutions or formal religions…just to lay out a path to righteousness. As Tielhard de Chardin said “We are not human beings having a spiritual experience, we are spiritual beings having a human experience.” The Phenomenon of Man, 1955, a Jesuit paleontologist.
I could go on and on and bore the shit out of anyone but suffice it to say I reject most of the tenets of Catholicism and see myself as a challenge to make people look deeper and not just take that which is given on a platter. This answer is irrelevant to the blog topic, but I did want to graciously answer your question.
I’m an old man with many experiences and still search…I may be wrong and I maybe in error, but I try to do good and the right thing. If you want to know more about me and my background, I have little to hide…email me at [email protected]. I do not stalk, I love discourse. If I failed to answer your questions, please hit me over the head with a Red Sox bat and ask again.
Phil, just a quick gut check for you about your assertion that you never judge people. On the transgender thread elsewhere on this site, you called me and the other commenters who disagree with you (and agree with the Church) “oppressors”. Simply for stating our Catholic beliefs, we are “oppressors”. Is that indicative of someone who does not judge others? It sort of dampened the otherwise interesting and important conversation we were having.
Leila,
Oppression is an action or a behavior which is which is perceived by the victim as devaluing his or her humanity. Good people can be oppressors. I do not judge the intent of anyone to purposefully hurt another; I am saying clearly that I judge actions which do hurt others as oppressive… hurt is in the eye of the beholder.It’s akin to your Catholic version of love the sinner, but hate the sin.
Phil, so basically you are not a Catholic or even a Christian. In fact the Bible is the most known of all ancient texts. We have all the scriptures long before Constantine. In fact all of them were written before 100 AD, which is why the gnostic gospels were left out. Gnostics were not Christians and came much later. Your equating other figures with Jesus has been refuted many times. If Christians were just another form of pagan then why did the pagans not notice it and stop persecuting them? Read the stories you mention, do they sound like Jesus and or anything remotely Jewish? I don’t think Catholics can be accused of avoiding St. Thomas lol. That is ridiculous and you don’t know the Fathers as well as you might think. Unfortunately, as is often the case in these debates, you throw up a series of accusations that would take a book to refute. But everything that you claim has been answered and can be answered. Visit http://www.catholic.com. Yet the question that remains is why you bother to post here? You are not a teacher in a Catholic school nor even a Catholic. What do you care? You seem to have lost the faith, assuming you were Catholic, due to buying into secular propaganda. I have heard everything you claimed before from others or on the “history” channel. You say you might be in error. Yes, you are. Take a step back. Actually read what Catholic Answers offers in response to these claims or even write them with your questions. Find out the truth. Cheers.
I’d be happy to respond to you in full privately with much greater detail..I did give you my e-mail and I will give you an explanation about why I blog here and also more data about me so you understand
Cheers, back at you
Phil said: “I believe this loss of faith and credibility of the RC Church is the work of the Holy Spirit…deconstructing the church so that it can begin again and be what it should be. Amen!”
Phil also said: “I know that there have been 30 born of virgins, crucified on a cross or tree, and risen from the dead gods begining with Horus and Isis in the Egyptian mystery schools. The Bible story and the Christ story has been seen historically in many religious variants. So, I do not believe in a personal deity, I do not believe in the infallibility of the Pope, I believe that the RC Church relegated women to an inferior role and establish a patriarchy in the era from 700-1300. Remember that the goddess Gaia was displaced by a male god.”
Does anybody else see a contradiction here? Anyone at all?
Phil, you are one confused, messed up whack-a-doodle. Just be honest with yourself. You can’t have it both ways. And has it ever occurred to you that Christianity is patriarchal because Judaism is patriarchal? As were almost all ancient societies? There’s evolutionary and biological reasons for this arrangement. It didn’t just pop up in the lower middle ages. It’s always been there, except for brief, periodic interruptions, like what we as a civilization are going through right now.
Phil further said: “Even Pope Francis will say that women are excluded from the priesthood, but has used the words “at this time” and “presently.” Celibacy and the exclusion of women from the priesthood, I believe are, are matters of church practice and discipline and not dogma. We know that Peter, the first pope, was a married man…why would his successors be celibate?”
That is total and complete bullshit and you know it. When did Pope Francis ever say that? Document your sources. Moreover, if you had been that knowledgable of a Catholic, you would have known, and would still know, that the Church has always had married priests. The west started instituting mandatory celibacy around the 11th century, but bishops, both east and west, have been taken from celibates, widowers, and monastics from the second century onward for practical reasons.
And regarding the exclusion of women from the ordained priesthood, that’s dogma. In the Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, Syriac Orthodox, and Nestorian Churches, and in all apostolic Churches for that matter. And as Pope John Paul II of blessed memory reiterated…just read his letter.
http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/apost_letters/documents/hf_jp-ii_apl_22051994_ordinatio-sacerdotalis_en.html
And on a personal note: Phil, I don’t like beating around the bush, and I’m the kind of guy who shoots straight from the hip and aims for the heart. Thus, I mean full offense when I say that you have no right, as a guy outside the Church, to tell Catholics how to live, just as I have no right to tell Jews to eat bacon. It’s none of my damn business. I’m not a Jew. And you don’t even believe in a personal God, so how the hell do you get off telling us that we’re not doing the will of the Mystic Life Principle or whatever you believe in? Newsflash: the Mystic Life Principle is impersonal, and impersonal things don’t give a crap about what we do or what we believe. They can’t. Because they’re impersonal. Do you understand, or is your logic that damaged and tied up with emotionalism?
Also, you said you weren’t bragging or using your story about taking care of your son as a shield against criticism in your discussions. If that were true, you would not have mentioned it at all. Look, I’m in a wheelchair, everybody’s got the same freaking problems, and everybody has made the same sort of freaking heroic sacrifices. You aren’t special. What you do doesn’t make you a good person. It’s more about how you do it. As Jesus said, “For if you love those who love you, what recompense will you have? Do not the tax collectors do the same? And if you greet your brothers only, what is unusual about that? Do not the pagans do the same? So be perfect, just as your heavenly Father is perfect” (Mt. 5:46-48).
An old man such as yourself should know better. The elderly are supposed to be fountains of wisdom, not leaky faucets of folly. I have no respect for you, and you have no respect for me or my fellow Catholics. You came to this post only to make trouble and to cause controversy so that you could delight in our reactions. Let’s just be honest with each other. Christian charity demands truth, and truth isn’t all snuggle bunnies and sugar pops.
I will happily enter into polite discourse; vitriol, name calling and abusive language…no! BTW, here are the references you requested,
http://www.irishcentral.com/news/Pope-Francis-said-celibacy-among-priests-can-change-and-admits-to-being-tempted-by-a-woman-199328231.html
http://www.usnews.com/opinion/blogs/susan-milligan/2013/03/21/pope-francis-opened-the-door-for-womens-equality-in-the-church
http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/pope-bergoglio-celibacy-law/2013/03/20/id/495558
Typical “shoot the messenger” response. The gentleman, who actually TEACHES in Catholic schools, tells you what he thinks the main problem is based on his experience. At least concede that he might have a point. Years ago, when my kids were young and in urban “magnet” public schools, I had numerous teachers tell me that the biggest different they saw between their students who succeeded was not income, but family life. Those with married parents whose mothers didn’t work, they told me, did hte best — even if the family was wealthy with two married, high-earning working parents. Now granted, that was anecdotal. But it seems to me that when professionals tell you an anecdote, you ought to at least think about it.
Phil, we agree on the married priest issue. What you did not cite, and what I asked for, was Pope Francis saying that women could become priests in the future. All your sources were irrelevant to that.
It is clear that you have absolutely no idea of what you are talking about as it relates to the orthodox One True Faith. It is clear that you have been selectively feeding on the cafeteria style Catholicism so prevalent today. May I suggest you learn the Faith or practice the adage to wit: “It is better to keep ones mouth shut and let people suspect you are a dolt rather than open it and confirm your stupidity.” Translation? Either learn the Faith or Button you mouth. You are embarrassing yourself.
Society is obsessed with sex. The Church only addresses it because it needs to.
Moreover, the LCWR is not a group of “poor nuns.” They are sisters who have moved “beyond Jesus” by their own declaration. This is bad. Very bad.
Phil, you have reached a bunch of broadly-based, popular mainstream conclusions based on misperceptions of the Church. For over 2,000 years, the world has tried to change the church. It won’t happen. The gates of hell will never prevail. I invite you to look into the Theology of the Body. Look into Christopher West’s book, Theology of the Body for Beginners for a starting place in the whole truth.
The Catholic Church is the last place you can accuse of being “obsessed with sex”. We live in a society that has done that.
Also, look into the truthful statistics on sexual abuse in America. The abuse in public schools and home occurs at 10 times the rate at a Catholic Church. Abuse in the Church is a little less than most protestant churches. Either way it’s bad, but it’s not a problem that has anything to do with Catholicism.
See,
Double Standard: Abuse Scandals and the Attack on the Catholic Church by, David F. Pierre Jr.
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I think you speak very accurately on the current state of education. Many whole Catholics are leaving the Catholic schools because their domestic church is having to compete with the schools on teaching Catholicism.
It boggles my mind why Catholic schools have two classes like history and Church history. Why not use Catholic history books like the ones by Dr. Anne Carroll? Why not use Catholic business books? Why not teach CST in the same class as economics? Why not read classics more often like Dante in English departments? Why force service hours?
Lots of work, best of luck.
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